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#160062 - 02/14/05 07:25 PM What's up with Mary Alice/Angela?
Beatlelovr Administrator Offline
Amazingly Fab, Survivor Addicted Zapper!

Registered: 01/01/04
Posts: 23015
Loc: Central Virginia
Thoughts please.
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#160063 - 02/14/05 08:34 PM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: Beatlelovr]
Brent Online   content
Snow-Deprived Weatherdude

Registered: 07/28/03
Posts: 30865
Loc: Alabama
I have no earthly idea.

Also... Felicia Tillman called her "Angela Forrest" last night, why was she using that last name? If it was 15 years ago like she said, she should have already had Zach(he's closer to 18 I think) and been married to Paul, so why would her name be different.

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#160064 - 02/15/05 06:58 AM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: Brent]
Beatlelovr Administrator Offline
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Registered: 01/01/04
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Loc: Central Virginia
Quote:

I have no earthly idea.

Also... Felicia Tillman called her "Angela Forrest" last night, why was she using that last name? If it was 15 years ago like she said, she should have already had Zach(he's closer to 18 I think) and been married to Paul, so why would her name be different.




'Tis a mystery.
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#160065 - 02/15/05 08:40 AM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: Brent]
earthxdog Offline
21st Zentury Male

Registered: 07/06/03
Posts: 17005
Loc: Hollyweird, California
Quote:

I have no earthly idea.

Also... Felicia Tillman called her "Angela Forrest" last night, why was she using that last name? If it was 15 years ago like she said, she should have already had Zach(he's closer to 18 I think) and been married to Paul, so why would her name be different.




All my ideas are Earthly.

Ok... here's some speculation on that. Paul and Mary Alice are more than likely fugitives... OR... perhaps even witness protection program people? She obviously had another identity and life... and, as Brent brought up, her son is old enough to have been alive 15 years ago when they were IN that other life. SO... the whole family left Texas and moved to Wisteria lane with new names and identites.

Some theories:


  • Leaving Texas had something to do with Dana.... perhaps the child was kidnapped? Perhaps the killing actually took place IN Texas and that is what they ran because of?
  • This could further explain the intense cover-up of the daughter's death... to bring attention to it would bring attention to them... and they are obviously not desirous of doing that if they are hiding past lives and identities.
  • AND... it's obvious that Dana's death happened before they lived on Wisteria Lane... or neighbors would have known that the child existed. Being in a neighborhood and having two children and then all of a sudden one of them no longer exists would definitely be noticeable.
  • It is possible that Mary Alice and Paul have something to do with disappearance or death of Mike's wife? He is on Wisteria Lane looking for answers regarding HER... and we don't necessarily know where he came from... maybe Texas?


It was obvious to me that Paul was covering when dead neighbor lady's sister was recognizing Mary Alice /Angela. He is not in the dark about this... and is very much a part of that mystery.
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#160066 - 02/15/05 08:41 AM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: Brent]
Xharryb Offline
New Zapper

Registered: 01/20/05
Posts: 33
Loc: Florida
I thought zach's character was supposed to be closer to the 14/15 range. The actor may be a little older, but he's been romantically involved with susan's daughter who is only 13/14.

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#160067 - 02/15/05 08:43 AM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: earthxdog]
Beatlelovr Administrator Offline
Amazingly Fab, Survivor Addicted Zapper!

Registered: 01/01/04
Posts: 23015
Loc: Central Virginia
Quote:

It is possible that Mary Alice and Paul have something to do with disappearance or death of Mike's wife? He is on Wisteria Lane looking for answers regarding HER... and we don't necessarily know where he came from... maybe Texas?






This has been my theory for the longest time.
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#160068 - 02/15/05 08:46 AM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: Beatlelovr]
ragincajun Moderator Offline
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Registered: 05/10/04
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My theory is that Zack is Dana. Paul and Mary Alice kidnapped him and that is why they left Texas and changed their names. I also think that the missing woman, who Paul and/or Mary Alice killed, is Zack's real mother and that Mike is his real dad.
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#160069 - 02/15/05 08:56 AM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: ragincajun]
earthxdog Offline
21st Zentury Male

Registered: 07/06/03
Posts: 17005
Loc: Hollyweird, California
Quote:


My theory is that Zack is Dana. Paul and Mary Alice kidnapped him and that is why they left Texas and changed their names. I also think that the missing woman, who Paul and/or Mary Alice killed, is Zack's real mother and that Mike is his real dad.




That's brilliant. Zach is DANA!!! I have been assuming that DANA was a she... why wouldn't Dana be a HE? They took the child in Texas and brought him to Wisteria Lane with new names.... Excellent theory, Rajun!!


But then who was in the trunk???
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#160070 - 02/15/05 09:03 AM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: earthxdog]
Beatlelovr Administrator Offline
Amazingly Fab, Survivor Addicted Zapper!

Registered: 01/01/04
Posts: 23015
Loc: Central Virginia
Quote:

Quote:


My theory is that Zack is Dana. Paul and Mary Alice kidnapped him and that is why they left Texas and changed their names. I also think that the missing woman, who Paul and/or Mary Alice killed, is Zack's real mother and that Mike is his real dad.




That's brilliant. Zach is DANA!!! I have been assuming that DANA was a she... why wouldn't Dana be a HE? They took the child in Texas and brought him to Wisteria Lane with new names.... Excellent theory, Rajun!!


But then who was in the trunk???





Hey, I postulated this a few weeks back and people thought I was crazy. Dana's real mother is in the trunk.
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#160071 - 02/15/05 09:06 AM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: earthxdog]
ragincajun Moderator Offline
The Eye of the Tiger from the Zappy Bayou

Registered: 05/10/04
Posts: 31027
Loc: Terrytown, LA
Quote:

Quote:


My theory is that Zack is Dana. Paul and Mary Alice kidnapped him and that is why they left Texas and changed their names. I also think that the missing woman, who Paul and/or Mary Alice killed, is Zack's real mother and that Mike is his real dad.




That's brilliant. Zach is DANA!!! I have been assuming that DANA was a she... why wouldn't Dana be a HE? They took the child in Texas and brought him to Wisteria Lane with new names.... Excellent theory, Rajun!!


But then who was in the trunk???





Thanks!!! All those year of watching Y&R, The World, and The Light have to account for something.

Oh, as Beatle said, Dana/Zack's mom is in the trunk, i.e, the woman for whom Mike is looking.
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#160072 - 02/15/05 09:13 AM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: ragincajun]
earthxdog Offline
21st Zentury Male

Registered: 07/06/03
Posts: 17005
Loc: Hollyweird, California
Quote:

Quote:

Quote:


My theory is that Zack is Dana. Paul and Mary Alice kidnapped him and that is why they left Texas and changed their names. I also think that the missing woman, who Paul and/or Mary Alice killed, is Zack's real mother and that Mike is his real dad.




That's brilliant. Zach is DANA!!! I have been assuming that DANA was a she... why wouldn't Dana be a HE? They took the child in Texas and brought him to Wisteria Lane with new names.... Excellent theory, Rajun!!


But then who was in the trunk???





Thanks!!! All those year of watching Y&R, The World, and The Light have to account for something.

Oh, as Beatle said, Dana/Zack's mom is in the trunk, i.e, the woman for whom Mike is looking.




Hmmmm... very interesting. But then why, I wonder, would Mike not be looking for his child as well? He's never even mentioned that he was looking for a child as well as the woman....
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#160073 - 02/15/05 09:28 AM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: earthxdog]
Beatlelovr Administrator Offline
Amazingly Fab, Survivor Addicted Zapper!

Registered: 01/01/04
Posts: 23015
Loc: Central Virginia
Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:


My theory is that Zack is Dana. Paul and Mary Alice kidnapped him and that is why they left Texas and changed their names. I also think that the missing woman, who Paul and/or Mary Alice killed, is Zack's real mother and that Mike is his real dad.




That's brilliant. Zach is DANA!!! I have been assuming that DANA was a she... why wouldn't Dana be a HE? They took the child in Texas and brought him to Wisteria Lane with new names.... Excellent theory, Rajun!!


But then who was in the trunk???





Thanks!!! All those year of watching Y&R, The World, and The Light have to account for something.

Oh, as Beatle said, Dana/Zack's mom is in the trunk, i.e, the woman for whom Mike is looking.




Hmmmm... very interesting. But then why, I wonder, would Mike not be looking for his child as well? He's never even mentioned that he was looking for a child as well as the woman....



He's only looking for the woman, not knowing about the child.
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#160074 - 02/15/05 09:28 AM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: earthxdog]
ragincajun Moderator Offline
The Eye of the Tiger from the Zappy Bayou

Registered: 05/10/04
Posts: 31027
Loc: Terrytown, LA
Earth,

Maybe he didn't know that she was pregnant?? Maybe Mary Alice and Mrs. Huber's sister worked in one of those homes for unwed mothers? You know, where parents send teenagers to have babies when they don't want anyone to know about it. It would have made it really convenient for Mary Alice to take the kid.
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#160075 - 02/15/05 09:33 AM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: ragincajun]
Clayfanchrim Offline
Pearl Zapper

Registered: 05/06/04
Posts: 5757
Loc: CT USA
Why would Mike's wife be in a home for unwed pregnant women?
How could Mike NOT know his wife was pregnant? Did i miss something? Did Mike live with his wife? When did she go missing?
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#160076 - 02/15/05 09:41 AM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: ragincajun]
earthxdog Offline
21st Zentury Male

Registered: 07/06/03
Posts: 17005
Loc: Hollyweird, California
Quote:

Earth,

Maybe he didn't know that she was pregnant?? Maybe Mary Alice and Mrs. Huber's sister worked in one of those homes for unwed mothers? You know, where parents send teenagers to have babies when they don't want anyone to know about it. It would have made it really convenient for Mary Alice to take the kid.




That's feasible. The group picture did look to be some form of "medical" workplace... if I am not mistaken Angela was wearing some form of nurses smock. I'll buy these theories... it puts a lot of pieces in the puzzle. Very good sleuthing by all.

by GEORGE I think you've got it.
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#160077 - 02/15/05 09:45 AM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: earthxdog]
earthxdog Offline
21st Zentury Male

Registered: 07/06/03
Posts: 17005
Loc: Hollyweird, California
We must realize, of course, the interesting dynamic this creates, right?

If JAKE is Dana... and Dana was the woman's child... and the woman was married to MIKE... that would mean JAKE is MIKE's son... and since MIKE is dating SUSAN (I know they will break up... but I expect they will get back together) that would mean that they are technically bringing together SUSAN'S daughter and JAKE into a step-brother and sister sort of role (hypothetically, should they end up marrying)... while meanwhile possible future step brother and sister are currently playing Romeo and Juliet...

Fun show, eh?
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#160078 - 02/15/05 10:22 AM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: earthxdog]
Brent Online   content
Snow-Deprived Weatherdude

Registered: 07/28/03
Posts: 30865
Loc: Alabama
You Lost me... (No comments from the peanut gallery )

This is the first show of it's kind I have watched, but I'm addicted.

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#160079 - 02/15/05 11:50 AM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: Brent]
francheeta Offline
Frantastic Vol Queen

Registered: 07/23/04
Posts: 21625
Loc: Knoxville,Tn.
First they have never said the missing woman is Mike's wife. I believe they said it was his old girlfriend.
Second Mary Alice/Angela worked at a rehab center. The name was in the picture Mrs. Huber's sister had.
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#160080 - 02/15/05 12:58 PM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: francheeta]
earthxdog Offline
21st Zentury Male

Registered: 07/06/03
Posts: 17005
Loc: Hollyweird, California
Quote:

First they have never said the missing woman is Mike's wife. I believe they said it was his old girlfriend.
Second Mary Alice/Angela worked at a rehab center. The name was in the picture Mrs. Huber's sister had.




Actually... they never defined his relationship with the woman... so the wife thing might be a theory but so would your girlfriend statement... (it was not said.)

Frank (the old man) ONLY said you "found yourself a safe wife and left my daughter to rot". NOW... this could indicate that they were in a relationship and Mike left her for another woman and got married OR it could mean that he left one wife for another, "safer" one.

What is not explained is WHY she was not "safe"...

But Frank also said that he knew Mike would "take care of it" because: "After all, you already killed for her once." So... However the relationship was defined it obviously was a close one.
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#160081 - 02/15/05 01:32 PM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: earthxdog]
wimpeny Offline
Emerald Zapper

Registered: 12/05/03
Posts: 8213
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
What's the name of the woman Mike is looking for? I was getting confused about whether she was the angela.

And if Zack is Dana -- then where is the baby girl that Zack remembers?
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#160082 - 02/15/05 02:38 PM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: wimpeny]
earthxdog Offline
21st Zentury Male

Registered: 07/06/03
Posts: 17005
Loc: Hollyweird, California
Quote:

What's the name of the woman Mike is looking for? I was getting confused about whether she was the angela.

And if Zack is Dana -- then where is the baby girl that Zack remembers?




I'm not sure that they've ever said this woman's name. They have, however, pointed out Mary Alice to be Angela. So... I can say that the woman Mike is looking for and Angela are definitely two different women.

As for Zach and the memory of a younger sister... isn't it possible that the parents could have created this memory within him. Granted... this isn't going to make them parents of the year... but then Mary Alice/Angela WAS wracked with guilt and did commit suicide...
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#160083 - 02/15/05 02:41 PM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: wimpeny]
Mrs.Goldblum Offline
Bronze Zapper

Registered: 05/19/04
Posts: 1685
Loc: Portland, OR
Quote:

What's the name of the woman Mike is looking for? I was getting confused about whether she was the angela.

And if Zack is Dana -- then where is the baby girl that Zack remembers?




I believe that her name is/was Deirdre.
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#160084 - 02/15/05 06:25 PM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: Mrs.Goldblum]
Brent Online   content
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Registered: 07/28/03
Posts: 30865
Loc: Alabama
Quote:

Quote:

What's the name of the woman Mike is looking for? I was getting confused about whether she was the angela.

And if Zack is Dana -- then where is the baby girl that Zack remembers?




I believe that her name is/was Deirdre.




Yes... or at least that's what the show tells us.

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#160085 - 02/15/05 07:30 PM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: earthxdog]
Gambler Moderator Offline
Emerald Zapper

Registered: 11/15/03
Posts: 8489
WOW! awesome theories everyone!! Mike seemed to have some sort of connection with Zack... but anyways...

Here is my thought...

I think that the person in the box is Mary Alice Young! Angela killed Mary Alice Young in order to get a new identity to escape from something I just don't know what.

I think Paul may have been telling the truth about Dana and how she died as a baby.

However... Mike and Deidre? are somehow related and I think you guys may just be right with the whole Zack being Mikes son... just I don't know where deidre would be.

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#160086 - 02/15/05 08:19 PM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: Gambler]
francheeta Offline
Frantastic Vol Queen

Registered: 07/23/04
Posts: 21625
Loc: Knoxville,Tn.
Quote:

WOW! awesome theories everyone!! Mike seemed to have some sort of connection with Zack... but anyways...

Here is my thought...

I think that the person in the box is Mary Alice Young! Angela killed Mary Alice Young in order to get a new identity to escape from something I just don't know what.

I think Paul may have been telling the truth about Dana and how she died as a baby.

However... Mike and Deidre? are somehow related and I think you guys may just be right with the whole Zack being Mikes son... just I don't know where deidre would be.




Paul told Zack Dana is alive. I think he is lying to everyone else that she's dead. And told Zack the truth. He told him some secret about it, because Zack used it to get Paul to stay on Wisteria Lane.
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#160087 - 02/15/05 09:21 PM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: Gambler]
earthxdog Offline
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Registered: 07/06/03
Posts: 17005
Loc: Hollyweird, California
Quote:

WOW! awesome theories everyone!! Mike seemed to have some sort of connection with Zack... but anyways...

Here is my thought...

I think that the person in the box is Mary Alice Young! Angela killed Mary Alice Young in order to get a new identity to escape from something I just don't know what.

I think Paul may have been telling the truth about Dana and how she died as a baby.

However... Mike and Deidre? are somehow related and I think you guys may just be right with the whole Zack being Mikes son... just I don't know where deidre would be.




Yes, indeed... there are some very bright folks theorizing here.

And I like the Mary Alice in a box concept. very good.
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#160088 - 02/16/05 06:22 AM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: Gambler]
Brent Online   content
Snow-Deprived Weatherdude

Registered: 07/28/03
Posts: 30865
Loc: Alabama
Quote:

WOW! awesome theories everyone!! Mike seemed to have some sort of connection with Zack... but anyways...

Here is my thought...

I think that the person in the box is Mary Alice Young! Angela killed Mary Alice Young in order to get a new identity to escape from something I just don't know what.

I think Paul may have been telling the truth about Dana and how she died as a baby.

However... Mike and Deidre? are somehow related and I think you guys may just be right with the whole Zack being Mikes son... just I don't know where deidre would be.




WOW... I never thought about Mary Alice being in the box, but now it makes sense seeing that she was really known as Angela.

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#160089 - 02/16/05 09:30 AM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: Brent]
Xharryb Offline
New Zapper

Registered: 01/20/05
Posts: 33
Loc: Florida
Combining theories with a bit of my own thrown in...

Zack is Dana. He was kidnapped by Mary Alice & Paul and raised as their own. His mother is the dead woman in the trunk. His memories of killing Dana are a morphed creation of his imagination and or brainwashing on the part of his "parents." He does have vague memories of a traumatic incident involving blood and death, but this is actually the death of his mother. He has been led to believe that he did the killing and that it was of a sibling so that he would be less likely to come forward with the information. Why would he turn himself in right?

I'm still a little fuzzy connecting with Mike though. Perhaps Zack's mother is the woman Mike has been looking for (something I've believed forever no matter what other theories we are going with). They were young sweethearts, first loves perhaps. He left her (not sure the circumstances). Maybe, they had a pregnancy scare, he thought she was going to abort it it and couldn't deal, but then she kept it and he never knew? I don't know. Still working on that part...

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#160090 - 02/16/05 09:53 AM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: Xharryb]
Clayfanchrim Offline
Pearl Zapper

Registered: 05/06/04
Posts: 5757
Loc: CT USA
Very nice theory!! Good job,Xharryb!! I was confused about the Whole idea of Zach Being Mike's son and how could he not know that but, Your theory makes sense if the woman in the box was really Mike's young sweetheart who had his son after he took off. Angela/Mary Alice could have been the killer...could have been Paul too. He's the one who took the trunk and hauled it away. Why was the trunk hidden for so long and why would he dump it only after his wife committed suicide? Afraid that his wife's suicide would start the ball rolling and had to get rid of the evidence? Did he know about the note before she died? Did she share it with him? Who was the note from? Mrs. Huber's sister? Why doesn't she just come forward or call the police? Is she part of the same undercover operation that Mike is a part of? Is she helping Mike? That's what I don't understand. If someone knows that this crime happened and who did it then why wouldn't they go to the authorities instead of all this secrecy and hiding. Are they trying to blackmail Paul? What does he have that they might want to blackmail him for? Zack? Does Zack have some kind of wealth associated with him, a legacy........?????
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#160091 - 02/16/05 10:27 AM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: Clayfanchrim]
francheeta Offline
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Registered: 07/23/04
Posts: 21625
Loc: Knoxville,Tn.
Do we know for sure Mary Alice killed herself? She could have been murdered.
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#160092 - 02/16/05 10:37 AM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: francheeta]
earthxdog Offline
21st Zentury Male

Registered: 07/06/03
Posts: 17005
Loc: Hollyweird, California
Quote:

Do we know for sure Mary Alice killed herself? She could have been murdered.




Didn't they show her putting the gun to her head in the first episode?
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#160093 - 02/16/05 11:01 AM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: earthxdog]
francheeta Offline
Frantastic Vol Queen

Registered: 07/23/04
Posts: 21625
Loc: Knoxville,Tn.
Quote:

Quote:

Do we know for sure Mary Alice killed herself? She could have been murdered.




Didn't they show her putting the gun to her head in the first episode?




You might be right. I can't recall and I don't have it on tape.
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#160094 - 02/16/05 02:13 PM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: francheeta]
Brent Online   content
Snow-Deprived Weatherdude

Registered: 07/28/03
Posts: 30865
Loc: Alabama
Yes... we saw the Mary Alice character commit suicide. Mrs. Huber found her. That was before the opening credits even rolled.

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#160095 - 02/16/05 10:36 PM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: Beatlelovr]
SunnyBear Offline
Silver Zapper

Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 4163
Loc: Cerealia
These are edited parts of the recap from episode two from TWoP (thank you) which leads me to believe that there was a murdered child, and Paul was trying to destroy the evidence. I also added a few items that I remember from the episode.

Help me out here if you remember something else.



Over at the Mary Alice home, where the pool has been totally dug up, Paul drags what looks like a child's toy chest into his shed and looks shiftily at it.

Paul loads the toy chest into the back of his SUV and then slams the trunk. Paul gets in the car and drives off.

At night, Paul takes the chest out of the back of the car and throws it in a lake or body of water.

Later, Paul sees a news report on TV about the toy chest that surfaced in the water. The news reporter announced that the chest contained bones of a small body. Zack walks in and Paul shuts off the TV quickly so he doesn't see the news report.

Make of it what you will. It was only the second episode. The information is interesting, yet confusing, considering all the new information we have learned.

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#160096 - 02/17/05 02:52 PM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: SunnyBear]
francheeta Offline
Frantastic Vol Queen

Registered: 07/23/04
Posts: 21625
Loc: Knoxville,Tn.
Quote:

These are edited parts of the recap from episode two from TWoP (thank you) which leads me to believe that there was a murdered child, and Paul was trying to destroy the evidence. I also added a few items that I remember from the episode.

Help me out here if you remember something else.



Over at the Mary Alice home, where the pool has been totally dug up, Paul drags what looks like a child's toy chest into his shed and looks shiftily at it.

Paul loads the toy chest into the back of his SUV and then slams the trunk. Paul gets in the car and drives off.

At night, Paul takes the chest out of the back of the car and throws it in a lake or body of water.

Later, Paul sees a news report on TV about the toy chest that surfaced in the water. The news reporter announced that the chest contained bones of a small body. Zack walks in and Paul shuts off the TV quickly so he doesn't see the news report.

Make of it what you will. It was only the second episode. The information is interesting, yet confusing, considering all the new information we have learned.




I remember all of this Sunny, except I thought they said they found a womens boby in the water?
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#1490446 - 05/21/09 12:21 AM Re: What's up with Mary Alice/Angela? [Re: Brent]
aaren Offline
Iron Zapper

Registered: 02/26/09
Posts: 108
Originally Posted By: Brent
Yes... we saw the Mary Alice character commit suicide. Mrs. Huber found her. That was before the opening credits even rolled.


You are right!!
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